Jon Posted August 9, 2018 Report Share Posted August 9, 2018 Well I have waded through a multitude of misleading advertising for LED conversions and read many reviews written by a cross section of motorists. I have concluded that there's a small handful of respected manufacturers striving to make quality products that are still denied ECE legal recognition and the rest who are on the band wagon with cheap copies that should never should be recognised. The vast number of fleabay offerings are quite simply counterfeit rubbish appealing to the fashion conscious. God help us if we meet them on the public highway ! However one new product that came available in May this year has caught my eye. Of course they have no ECE approval but seem to tick many boxes. Philips X-trend Ultinon Comments invited 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted August 9, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted August 9, 2018 On 7/31/2018 at 9:32 AM, Laird_Scooby said: aim for LED patterns that mimic the original filament - usually Philips LumiLEDs are a good indication of the right sort of LEDs in the bulb. 25 minutes ago, Jon said: However one new product that came available in May this year has caught my eye. Of course they have no ECE approval but seem to tick many boxes. Philips X-trend Ultinon They have previously been mentioned Jon. I've had a set of H4 LED headlamp bulbs in my Sterling for about 2-4 years now, a pair in my Volvo for 2 years ish. What confuses me is the bulbs fitting the description you provided that i found on things like Amazon.com (the USA site, didn't find any on the UK site) all refer to "ECE R37" approval with a "X" on it. I'm not surprised as ECE R37 is specifically for automotive filament bulbs! It seems there is also an "ECE 48" regulation which may cover it as they are LED bulbs, however i haven't gone through the various documents i found referred to on this. If you can shed any more light on the CE approval status that might help somewhat. Also, if a manufacturer the size of Philips has not only developed but is actively marketing and producing these bulbs, there can't be much wrong with them! Likewise if they are fakes, Philips have a huge legal department and would have jumped all over anybody producing fakes especially when they're being marketed so widely. I think the idea behind them saying not ECE37 approved and "Not for road use" is to cover their collective ar5e, in other words, use them in your road car but don't dazzle anyone, if you do and get done for it, it's your problem. That said it's just as easy to dazzle someone with halogens or even basic tungsten filament bulbs if they're badly aligned. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted September 5, 2018 Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 Has anyone had any experience of M-Tech Platinum by Power Bulbs please ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PTR200S Posted September 5, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted September 5, 2018 Never used them but a mate told me they do a big range of lighting gear and been around for a few years so maybe the company ok however, the LED stuff was not road legal. I presume you were referring to LED ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 Thank you PTR 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted September 25, 2018 Administrators Report Share Posted September 25, 2018 Just ordered some road legal Philips bulbs, not LED not cheap either as the OSRAM night breakers just not cutting for one coupe owner, looks like they have faded in only 2 years so decided to try an alternative, will post up my first impressions tomorrow that's if I've still got the car when its dark, highly probable... ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted September 25, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted September 25, 2018 THe local fuzz round my way complain about the Nightbreakers doing that and reckon they need changing every 2 months! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted September 25, 2018 Report Share Posted September 25, 2018 I have yet to the plunge with LED headlights so will be very interested in your findings. I did fit LED sidelights which are fine and I also fitted LED reversing lights which were not. They look the part, very bright and white but they just don't light the way as well as standard bulbs. I have ordered some Xenon effect blue glass bulbs and will see if they are any good this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PTR200S Posted September 25, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted September 25, 2018 3 hours ago, Laird_Scooby said: THe local fuzz round my way complain about the Nightbreakers doing that and reckon they need changing every 2 months! I know we have discussed this before re the nightbreaker failures but i have to say that the ones fitted uo my Jag three years ago , nearly, are still performing ,erm, brilliantly ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PTR200S Posted September 25, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted September 25, 2018 56 minutes ago, Jon said: I have ordered some Xenon effect blue glass bulbs and will see if they are any good this weekend. That's the type I have in the Coupe and they are really good for the money ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted September 26, 2018 Report Share Posted September 26, 2018 That's very encouraging PTR , thank you ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted September 26, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted September 26, 2018 17 hours ago, PTR200S said: That's the type I have in the Coupe and they are really good for the money ! Before i went for LEDs that's what i used to use as well, very good bulbs for the price. 7 hours ago, Jon said: That's very encouraging PTR , thank you ! Be encouraged Jon - after switching to LEDs i got a couple of friends with the same sort of car, one running those bulbs, the other with Nightbreakers and we did a side-by-side test. The results were surprising - best were the LEDs, next best were this type of bulb and bringing up adimly lit rear were the Nightbreakers. Somewhere i have a photo, it was on here but got Photobucketed and i'm not sure where it is now. The only minor difference is they were H4 bulbs but the glass envelope doesn't know what fitting it's in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted September 26, 2018 Administrators Report Share Posted September 26, 2018 Well car went sooner as the body shop I've been using couldn't organise a piss up in the brewery so ended up doing their job and I will have to wait for the owner to report back, he is a club member so hopefully, he will share his findings? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted October 9, 2018 Report Share Posted October 9, 2018 Well the Lumro Xeon W21W reversing light bulbs arrived and were duly fitted. I can't say they were as good as I had hoped. They are blue and produce a nice white light but again the way finding performance appeared to be lacking for me at least. Back to the drawing board. However while I was looking for them I came across a package deal for 2x80 watt HB 4's and 2x100 watt HB 3's, Xenon by stripey-elite.com all for £14.15 including postage, so I grabbed them, Fleabay of course. Did the swap on Saturday and removed the tired old blackened bulbs by Stanley. ( I suppose they can't be original.....can they ? ) Filament positions appeared identical which was a good start.They were a complete revelation for me out on the road. Curious though I thought I might get flashed but didn't. Still curious and being a flyer of electric model aircraft I decided to see what was going on. Using my digital watt meter and a fully charged 125ah 12 volt battery, I set up a bench test. I only tested 2 bulbs. First was one of the very used Stanley HB3's rated at 80 watts and the other one my new Elite Xenon HB3's rated at 100 watts. They both recorded 64 watts at 11.9 volts, 5.38 amps ! My next move will be to manufacture a rig to take readings on the car and see how they get on at 14.4 volts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 9, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted October 9, 2018 14 minutes ago, Jon said: I only tested 2 bulbs. First was one of the very used Stanley HB3's rated at 80 watts and the other one my new Elite Xenon HB3's rated at 100 watts. They both recorded 64 watts at 11.9 volts, 5.38 amps ! My next move will be to manufacture a rig to take readings on the car and see how they get on at 14.4 volts. With thos figures, 11.9v, 5.38A that gies a resistance of 2.212 ohms. Divide 14v by 2.212 = 6.32A. Power = Voltage x Current so 14v x 6.32A = 88.6W. It's unlikely the 14.4v will last long enough to get a reading as that usually only applies to a cold voltage regulator in the alternator. It usually settles at 14v and you'll probably find the alternator output is rated at 14v as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted October 10, 2018 Report Share Posted October 10, 2018 Hi Dave Thank you for your interest with this. Rightly or wrongly I had assumed that the manufacturers of these bulbs which rely on a variable voltage would base their claims on a nominal voltage of 12v. I never expected the Chinese Fleabay bulbs to support their claimed performance but I was surprised by the Stanley bulb reading. I am now intrigued because they are identical. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 10, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted October 10, 2018 First thing to check Jon is the Stanley bulbs - i would have expected 55W or maybe 60W if they were original. The other thing is, it depends which market the bulbs are destined for. If it's the UK market, they are rated at 12v, if it's the USA market, they rate them at 14v. For example, the standard, 12v 21W bulb, as used in indicators, reverse lamps, rear fogs etc when powered with 14v produces 25W which is what they're rated at in the USA. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted October 10, 2018 Report Share Posted October 10, 2018 Very interesting that the U.S. uses a different system, thank you. Slightly improved my bench rig today (the on car rig will take a little longer). Now with an off load voltage of 14.15. Was rather short of time but did manage to hook up a Stanley 80 watt HB3. Saw 71 watts for a moment at 12.85 volts but things were moving pretty fast. Hope to have more time come the weekend. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 10, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted October 10, 2018 I only discovered it by accident, would you believe because i needed a new headlamp bulb for my vacuum cleaner? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeanoCoupe Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 Found these.... Would they be ok? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Nighteye-2x-9000LM-H7-9005-HB3-9006-HB4-H4-H11-LED-Headlight-Light-Bulbs-White/263904644477?hash=item3d71f14d7d:m:mz-37yUI-fbUo1T_mZQ6qNg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 12, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 NO!!! Not only no, but HELL NO!!! Those COB LED chips are way too big to mimic the filament, all they do is give a "wall of light" with no reflected light being directed where it should be. They're ok-ish for the full beam inner pair to a point but you'll probably get fed up with the "light scatter" and getting reflections back from Mars, Saturn, Venus and so on. I kid you not on this, i have a pair very similar as the inner main beam lamps on my Sterling, bear in mind the outer pair have H4s in with proper LED bulbs so i still get the correct beam pattern etc but as i don't use the car very much at night, it isn't a great problem but the light scatter is annoying. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 The "on car" rig was easier than I first thought but did require a sacrificial bulb and didn't tell me much. I set it up on "the easy to get" at offside inner where I have a Stripey Elite Xenon 100 watt bulb. With engine running the volts were modest at 12.1 and the bulb was only pulling 66 watts ! Back to the bench which now has revised power and can maintain a solid 12 volts under full load. A used Hb4 Stanley 51 watt at 12.0 volts was spot on at 51 watts. A used Stanley Hb3 60 watt at 12.0 volts drew a healthy 64 watts. If I have previously said these were rated at 80 watts I was wrong.....should have gone to Specsavers. I believe this is what Dave said I would find. Final step will be one more power upgrade to achieve 14 volts on the bench and test the Stripey Elites. Back to my reversing light saga and my most recent disappointment with Xenon 21 watt W3W's having previously tried Osram W21W LED's. Seemed l had exhausted all options there being no more wedge type bulbs to try. What I needed was a way to use alternative bulbs and set about using modelling techniques to make wedge adapters which would not damage the original bulb holders. Fortunately there is a huge range 12v halogens aimed at the medical market. I settled for a modest increase to 35 watts using Osram Halostar GY6.35's. They don't appear particularly bright and nothing like as bright to look at as the LED's but I am very pleased to say that my ability to see where I am going is greatly improved ! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 13, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/gy6-35-hir-921-reverse-light-upgrade-vs-high-power-leds.474996/ Have a look through that Jon, particularly the pics where he measures the lens temperature of the reverse lights after 20 minutes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 Well it just goes show everything's been done before somewhere. But oh boy what butchery ! My pins remain perfectly straight and no heat can be conducted down to the holder. I have no concerns on the temperature front. Final bench test at a solid 14.0 volts was revealing. Stripey Elite Hb3 advertised at 100 watts drew a measly 82 watts. I conclude for now I am a massive 2 watts better off. I am not ready to take the LED route and maybe will see what HID is all about ? Thanks Dave for your valuable input and bareing with me, after all of that I need a beer. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 13, 2018 Moderators Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 47 minutes ago, Jon said: My pins remain perfectly straight and no heat can be conducted down to the holder. I have no concerns on the temperature front. This is the bit i was on about Jon : That's 153F on the outside of the reverse light lens. The light bulb socket may be similar or higher but that's kind of worrying on a plastic lens! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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