Founding Member AhsyV6 Posted January 2, 2016 Founding Member Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 hello all, i seemed to remember a topic on wheel alignment but I can't find it. In the past when getting the cg2 aligned I recall that it cannot be found on the machine so they base it on another model. I remember a member stating the settings they prefer when aligning. My tyres are wearing on the insides and I need to understand what would be the best setting to aliminate this? Any thoughts? Ahsanul ps Happer new year all!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member Retro Rich Posted January 2, 2016 Founding Member Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 Happy new year!Stuart will be able to verse you with the specifics, but due to the weight of the car I believe the wheels "splay out" slightly. As a result a "toe in" is required to enable even wear.I believe the "settings" have to be downloaded or purchased from the USA. Stuart's local garage in Burton have the settings if you want to swing by, and I'm sure Stuart would be delighted to see you and the coupe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member AhsyV6 Posted January 2, 2016 Author Founding Member Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 Thanks for the response mate.......it's a good job I can't swing by because otherwise I'd be round there all the time with an issue that needs sorting!!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted January 2, 2016 Administrators Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 Thanks for the response mate.......it's a good job I can't swing by because otherwise I'd be round there all the time with an issue that needs sorting!!!! All age related niggles lol and you would be welcomed m8 Anyway the spec's do say dead ahead for 16' rims so 17's will need to toe in a little depending on the width of the rim and did you not say you had 215 rims with 225 tyres so this could be additional culprit to inner wear My coupe used to eat the inner treads but since lowering and the set-up toe in a little its been sweet as a nut with no accelerated wear since 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted January 2, 2016 Moderators Report Share Posted January 2, 2016 Good points there Stu - when i fitted the BBS rims on the coupé i noticed it had less of a tendency to pull. I know the rear tracking is out on both the coupé and the Sterling and since fitting the BBS rims (7J) it's altered the tracking slightly. Bearing in mind the original Rover wheels were 6J this extra inch per wheel has obviously altered things a bit. I really must extract my digit and repair my self-designed/built pantograph tracking gauge and sort the tracking on all 3 cars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member AhsyV6 Posted January 3, 2016 Author Founding Member Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 Can you suggest what the setting should be for a slight toe in please? Btw the inner wear is on all the tyres and also this has been a very gradual wear as I have done 20k on these tyres so far but not sure how much mileage I can get out of them now. Tomorrow I'm having my wheels refurbed again and was thinking of asking the guy to swap the tyres left to right so that the wear appears on the outer and then I will then get some equal wear? Every now and then I have a stupid thought which I feel is logical and I'm not embarrassed to share it.....what do you think(not if I'm stupid or not)? Thanks ps yes Stu 225 or 215 and the road handling is brilliant for it in my humble opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted January 3, 2016 Administrators Report Share Posted January 3, 2016 I would say -0.35/-0.50 degrees not knowing your current before measurements as yours could be out to the point of unavoidable wear anyway and will also depend how much you rear is out? Also did you get any readings while you where waiting for them to find your car on the system as it should be default dead ahead when on the ramp Negative toe is often used in front wheel drive vehicles for the opposite reason. The suspension arms pull slightly inward, so a slight negative toe will compensate for the drag and level out the wheels at speed. However with age and mileage considered on our coupe the suspension components wear, so a slight positive toe (toe in) can be more desirable to avoid premature tyre wear 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member AhsyV6 Posted January 4, 2016 Author Founding Member Report Share Posted January 4, 2016 Thank you mate for the detailed response 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member Mazda Man Posted January 5, 2016 Founding Member Report Share Posted January 5, 2016 It's like the Hokey Cokey on here...."toe in, toe out, shake it all about, do the Hokey Cokey and turn around....." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted January 5, 2016 Moderators Report Share Posted January 5, 2016 It's like the Hokey Cokey on here...."toe in, toe out, shake it all about, do the Hokey Cokey and turn around....." If it's shaking all about the wheels need balancing Geoff! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member AhsyV6 Posted January 20, 2016 Author Founding Member Report Share Posted January 20, 2016 On 3 January 2016 at 10:31 PM, hughezee said: I would say -0.35/-0.50 degrees not knowing your current before measurements as yours could be out to the point of unavoidable wear anyway and will also depend how much you rear is out? Also did you get any readings while you where waiting for them to find your car on the system as it should be default dead ahead when on the ramp Negative toe is often used in front wheel drive vehicles for the opposite reason. The suspension arms pull slightly inward, so a slight negative toe will compensate for the drag and level out the wheels at speed. However with age and mileage considered on our coupe the suspension components wear, so a slight positive toe (toe in) can be more desirable to avoid premature tyre wear I had the front wheels aligned on Friday along with replacing my old tyres with 4 new Dunlop SP MAXX RT 225/45/17 91Y for £295 inc fitting & balancing via Cartyres.com and fitted at a Halfords Autocentre. Excellent price. My tracking was out by "5" degrees but not sure which way!!! They checked the Autodata site for the settings and they said that it recommended parallel give or take 2 degrees either way. I showed them your suggestion and they then set it at what they said to be the average setting between Stus' and Autodatas' at 1 degree toe out. Conclusion(in my humble opinion): My coupe feels like a different car now! The steering feels lighter (tyres were regularly checked for tyre pressure), the car feels much smoother and I cannot express how significant the road noise reduction is! There used to be sudden pulling and this seems to be gone now but will keep an eye on it. All in all I am so impressed. The service I experienced at this particular Autocentre was brilliant. When I told them to be extra mindful of my newly refurbished wheels they initially said they would not risk replacing the tyres. This was because they felt the paint had not cured yet and the walls on the Falkens I had on where very stiff and could cause damage coming off. I called my Refurb man and he told me that these were powder coated and would not cure any further than they have already EVEN if left for another 10 years. Also they only cure above 165 degrees which they'd already been subjected to. When I told the Halfords manager that they had been powder coated he understood exactly what I told him and got the workshop to start the work. I must say that I watched them handle the car, the wheels and even down to how they placed the torque wrench around the wheel nuts.....with such care and attention and exactly they way I would have done it myself. There was a misunderstanding with regards to the wheel alignment in that I thought is was 4 wheel whereas they were only set up for 2 wheel. Based on this they didn't charge me for the alignment. Excellent service! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted January 20, 2016 Moderators Report Share Posted January 20, 2016 Did they check the rear wheel alignment before the fronts? The rear wheels can be checked using the tracking gauges but because of the design they usually have to be placed the "wrong" way round so any toe-out now needs to be viewed as toe-in and vice versa. At least they didn't charge you for the alignment but i wonder if it was done correctly? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted January 20, 2016 Administrators Report Share Posted January 20, 2016 Excellent stuff m8y, still sounds like the new rubber placebo effect but seriously keep an eye on the edges of the tyres looking for distinctive rubbing marks as this will determine if the alignment is still marginally out or not, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member AhsyV6 Posted January 20, 2016 Author Founding Member Report Share Posted January 20, 2016 I too questioned (for a split second )the placebo effect but the difference/improvement was too obvious. Will defo keep an eye on the rubber and there's also a12k mile/12 month guarantee and they said to go back if I have any issues the with ride or wear and they'll do it again free of charge. Funnily enough Dave the manager also said that if he wasn't so busy he would've reversed everything and checked the rears but this was also against company policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kag8 Posted October 20, 2017 Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 Huge bump I know but this might be the most relevant thread... So I've been to get my alignment checked finally, one of the tyre shops with a Hunter machine which apparently is very good. The weird thing is the shop said Caster is not adjustable on my coupe??? Is that right? I'll upload a pic of my readings asap but mainly 1.41 front caster (red) and -.20 toe (also red). EDIT: Now uploaded pic. Also just noticed it says at the top except 2.2l, coupe. I guess it's being compared against the wrong readings?? My front tyres almost completely have worn out on the inner shoulder (whereas I was monitoring the outer edge, doh, my bad especially after having lowered the front should have aligned it much more before). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted October 20, 2017 Administrators Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 Recently had my wheel alignment done on the same system and the specs are generalised to cover the 98-03 UK model, the 3.0 coupes naturally have negative camber due to the extra weight of the V6 engine, so inner tyre wear is common. Although after lowering mine it corrected the camber issue and my inner wear was none existent on my former tyres which I replaced due to there age. The caster angle, I would take that info' with a pinch of salt as that's easily messed up with the device positioning aka human error. Anyway since the damage is done now, I would get some cheap boots and then have your fronts toe in slightly (0.50 max) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 20, 2017 Moderators Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 That's interesting, i've got a few thoughts but i'll hang fire until Stu has posted something, i may be way off track - every pun intended! *** EDIT *** Just seen Stus response, pretty much along the lines of what i was going to suggest but also check the brake reaction bar bushes - the long bar that links between the lower control arm and front subframe. If there is wear hear it could easily alter the castor angle. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kag8 Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 Thanks guys. I wish there was a honda coupe hotline I could call at times haha. I just happened to be able to leave work early and quickly went in for a check before they closed shop. So Caster isnt something I should worry about then. Toe, i need some, so rather than the minus -0.25 it should be positive 0.5 max? Worrying thing is ive only done about 1k miles since lowering it and the inner edges are finished! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 21, 2017 Moderators Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 I think when Stu says toe in by 0.5 max he means -0.5 on the figures you've got. Going to +0.5 would mean toeing out. To get an idea of what this means, stand up with your feet a few inches apart as you would normally then get your feet so the insteps are parallel or as good as. Now move your feet so the heels stay where they are but the big toes are nearer to each other. This is toe in. Again without moving your heels, move your feet so the big toes are further away - this is toe out. Now imagine that's what your front wheels are doing when viewed from above. Generally speaking, too much toe out will cause the inner edges of the tyres to scrub and too much toe in will cause the outer edges to scrub. Excess toe (in either direction) will cause the tyres to scrub very quickly and hard cornering will usually scrub the outer edges of the tyres fairly quickly regardless of toe setting. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators hughezee Posted October 21, 2017 Administrators Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 12 minutes ago, Laird_Scooby said: I think when Stu says toe in by 0.5 max he means -0.5 on the figures you've got. Spot on buddy, Thanks 23 minutes ago, kag8 said: Worrying thing is ive only done about 1k miles since lowering it and the inner edges are finished! Looking at the picture your current toe is way off, easily sorted with the adjustment on the tie rod ends. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member Brett Posted October 21, 2017 Founding Member Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 The 7th and 8th gen Accord suffer from rear camber problems and are not adjustable. There are lots of aftermarket fully adjustable camber arms and ball joints on the market now to correct this. Im currently running igalls ball joints and adjustable toe in toe out arms and the tires are spot on now. Also these are a must for lowering your car on 7th and 8th gen. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member Brett Posted October 21, 2017 Founding Member Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 I’m not 100% if this is your car application but Hear is a link to a company in the USA Iv used and recommend. https://www.heeltoeauto.com/camber-kits-arms/ 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Laird_Scooby Posted October 21, 2017 Moderators Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 11 minutes ago, Brett said: Im currently running igalls ball joints Sounds painful! Have you tried a cream for that? Joking aside Brett, have you got a link please? i've not heard of that brand/type and i'd like to find out more. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member Brett Posted October 21, 2017 Founding Member Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 2 minutes ago, Laird_Scooby said: Sounds painful! Have you tried a cream for that? Joking aside Brett, have you got a link please? i've not heard of that brand/type and i'd like to find out more. Link above bud. Ingalls are very expensive but fantastic quality imo I have always had great reviews on there products. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Founding Member Brett Posted October 21, 2017 Founding Member Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 Just for ref this is the kit Iv been using for 3 years and have had no problems at all. https://www.heeltoeauto.com/ingalls-engineering-rear-camber-arm-and-ball-joint-kit-one-side-2009-14-acura-tsx-35623.html 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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